Banijay Rights’ Cathy Payne & Matt Creasey

Cathy Payne, the CEO of Banijay Rights, and Matt Creasey, the EVP of sales, co-productions and acquisitions outside EMEA, talk to World Screen about working with producers and clients whose needs continue to change.

With a catalog of 95,000-plus hours—resulting from Banijay’s acquisition of the Endemol Shine Group—Banijay Rights can satisfy just about any programming need. Whether commercial broadcasters keen to reach viewers and advertisers or SVODs seeking to attract and retain subscribers, they can choose from mega-brands like MasterChef or Big Brother, cost-effective factual series like Your Garden Made Perfect, stylish crime dramas like Grantchester or addictive series like The Fall. Even in a challenging year like 2020, this trove of shows kept Payne and Creasey extremely busy.

WS: Cathy, what a time to come to market with your huge catalog to satisfy demand, isn’t it?
PAYNE: One of the great things about the Banijay catalog is the amount of rights retained, especially for the big international franchises. We have product available for both ends of the spectrum—that which travels widely internationally alongside the domestic library that has strong traction for relicensing in its home market. In addition to the growing number of OTT global services, demand is high from linear broadcasters expanding their domestic VOD platforms.

WS: How has the market evolved over the last 12 months?
CREASEY: One thing that Covid has highlighted is that new programming is in demand. If you’ve got shows going into production and coming out the other end, both scripted or unscripted, the demand for that programming is unprecedented. That’s due to the U.S. or other countries where production has been slower coming back, creating gaps [in schedules]. But it’s also the proliferation of new platforms trying to build an arsenal of content for their launches.

In terms of what they are looking for, it’s evolved. In March of last year, there was a lot [about] Covid lockdown. That went away a long time ago. No one wants to see that on their screens. They want escapism. Escapism can go from a dark, complicated thriller drama to a light, frothy, feel-good entertainment show.

WS: Do you have clients now who have smaller budgets, and if so, how are you working with them?
PAYNE: No doubt, Covid impacted both revenue and costs, although, on the revenue front, we have seen a recovery in the advertising market. While Covid caused the immediate issue of costs due to shutdowns and a longer production process with additional protocol, pressure on budgets already existed before the pandemic. All markets need original content that is made at a more affordable price point. Unscripted original production provides that, and during the pandemic, non-scripted could return faster. We also experienced a number of non-scripted series having their runs extended. As a global group, we experienced different levels of shutdowns from territory to territory and were able to share best practices within the group. We also do a lot of format licensing outside the Banijay footprint territories. We were happy with the level of local production we were able to maintain and how successful that’s been, in particular with our big tentpole franchises such as MasterChef, Big Brother and Survivor.
CREASEY: It points to being a global company that’s not one-size-fits-all in terms of Covid restrictions. We’ve had territories like Australia where, despite some delays, we’ve still seen a massive output of unscripted. In the U.K., we’ve got brand-new franchises coming into the market and new seasons of very established franchises, which as a viewer, or a subscriber, or a platform, you wouldn’t know the work done behind the scenes. We’ve been able to go into production quicker with unscripted. It’s more of the premium drama that we’ve seen pushed back.

In the U.K., we’ve had shows like Your Garden Made Perfect, which is a follow-up to Your Home Made Perfect, produced during lockdown. We’ve had Temptation Island in the U.S. and other territories. We’ve got new U.S. seasons of Wipeout coming and LEGO Masters, as well. We have managed to keep Big Brother and Survivor going all around the world during the last 12 months. Survivor has been a challenge. But because of our global presence, we’ve been able to work in different locations. That we’ve had in the last 12 months the ability to produce unscripted under Covid conditions is so valuable within our group. And actually, we have others coming to us asking, How did you do it? I applaud all of our unscripted producers globally because where we are now, a year on, it’s been spectacular the number of shows we’ve got coming through.

WS: You work with producers from the very beginning of a project. Has any of that process changed because of the pandemic?
CREASEY: We’re carrying on as usual. We’ve been actively working with our producers for a long time, from development through to production and delivery of the shows. The need to find financing on shows has never been more vital, and our role within that has been key to a) help the deficit financing and b) find partners for shows. The proliferation of platforms, and in the U.S. where content had been delayed, has [increased platforms’] need to step in on co-productions. We’ve seen [more activity] in that area. Our position working and pitching with our producers has been accelerated in the last year.

WS: How have you seen co-productions evolve?
PAYNE: The challenges in financing the premium scripted have been around for the past couple of years. If a channel or platform wants a show that costs 3x and their domestic market is only paying 1x, it will only happen with a partner and a contribution from distribution. What has hit those premium dramas during Covid are the delays and additional protocols needed that result in not only production hiatus costs but ongoing costs once production commences. In general, broadcasters have been very good and stepped up, as have the distributors. Platforms and everyone have been amazing because they want those shows to continue. Financing premium drama won’t be going away anytime soon; however, it doesn’t mean to say that the most expensive shows are always the most successful, as I’ve often said.
CREASEY: We’re also seeing that we may have had commissioning broadcasters on certain franchises before. Recently, because there has been a bit of a hit in advertising revenues and the contributions to budgets have been readjusted on certain projects, we’ve brought in partners, or we had partners before who have become a greater partner. That relationship enabled us to maintain the franchise or even get the show made. I’m not sure how much more we’ll see of that, but that’s something we’ve been seeing. We’ve had shows that would have fallen over if other partners hadn’t stepped up. Everyone wins in that situation because the commissioning broadcaster is still keeping the show going, which they wanted. Another partner gets maybe more rights than previously would have had because of their step up, and then with us in the middle, we’re then able to take that show internationally as well. The motivation for everybody is aligned in wanting to get the show made.

WS: Buyers tend to ask for exclusive rights. Is there a willingness to make co-exclusive deals or share rights?
PAYNE: For the big premiere titles, for those exclusive must-watch shows, there is a need for exclusivity. But once you get to catalog programs or second runs or second-viewing windows, there is a tendency for more co-exclusivity across a number of platforms. For library, we are seeing more tolerance of the concept that a streamer would rather people stay on their service and watch that show on a non-exclusive basis rather than leave and find it somewhere else. This is all constantly evolving. Of course, for the must-have, I’m-pinning-my-schedule-on-this show, it’s going to be exclusive for some time.

WS: Would you give an example of how you managed to window a specific show.
PAYNE: It was quite interesting that last year there was quite a lot of press around The Fall.

It was performing very well on Netflix in the U.K. while it was simultaneously available on a number of platforms in the U.K.

CREASEY: The Fall is a great example. Over here in the U.S., we’ve been able to window that show. That show was originally on Netflix here. Those rights expired, and we’ve been able to do non-exclusive deals with a couple of platforms where it performs very well. And we’ve put it through Amazon Prime Video, where it’s one of the best performing dramas. We’ve got in on linear TV through Ovation and then another deal on Peacock for its launch.

WS: What business have you done with AVODs?
CREASEY: We were very early adopters of the AVOD space for library content. For a distributor with the size of library that we have, the AVODs have proved a brilliant new source of content supply and income. The majority is still non-exclusive library. We’re not going there yet for exclusivity or certainly not for co-productions. It’s still mostly library; however, we are seeing that open up more. We will see that open up more on Peacock, where we’re looking at maybe more enhanced deals. And IMDb TV would be the main one in the U.S., where we have been in very deep conversations about acquisitions and enhanced buys. They are competitive in the AVOD space.

AVOD is continually going to grow. It’s the very early stages. It’s pretty big in the U.S. In Europe, it’s breaking in from some of those U.S. platforms locally, as well. We’re not seeing the same revenues yet in comparison, but they will come. So AVOD is another buyer who will become more and more important.

WS: Any takeaways from these very trying last 12 months?
CREASEY: Cathy left our company, then went and joined another company that then bought us! The last 12 months have been eventful, to say the least!
PAYNE: It hasn’t exactly been a quiet 12 months. A lot of change. For me, whether it’s the pandemic or everything we’ve gone through at work and in the business, it’s the resourcefulness and the goodness of people. I know with Covid, there are many challenges still to come, but my gosh, there are a lot of clever people. When you all put your heads together, there’s that general wanting to share, wanting to keep the business going. No one wants any one of us to do poorly. I also feel a great sense of gratitude over the last months. We’ve got a team. We’re in a strong, well-managed company, one that is very diversified and really cares about the people who work for it.