Exclusive Interview: Mark Burnett

Since ancient Greece, audiences have been enthralled by competitions. Mark Burnett has taken that love for a good challenge to new levels, creating shows that feature ordinary people using their wits and street smarts to survive on deserted islands, in corporate boardrooms or even in classroom settings.

WS: When viewers tune in to a show that is produced by Mark Burnett, what can they expect? What are some of the signature characteristics of a Mark Burnett show?
BURNETT: A Mark Burnett show should be recognizable as a brand. We are pretty true to our brand, which has high-quality visuals, editing and storytelling. It doesn’t matter whether it’s Are You Smarter than a 5th Grader?, which is a game show where the storytelling is done from the point of view of adults who really have trouble answering school questions for 10-year-olds because they can’t remember them; or whether it’s The Apprentice, which is the world’s toughest job interview; or of course Survivor, which involves building a world on a remote island with people you’ve never met before. Whether it’s any of these shows it’s about the storytelling, but there certainly is a visual look and a shooting style going back to 1995 with my first show Eco-Challenge that is recognizable in all of our shows.

WS: What types of projects appeal to you?
BURNETT: I’m very competitive and competition shows are appealing to me. But it’s less about competition and more about surprising outcomes. The Apprentice and Survivor clearly are shows that have a weekly elimination and are done with a high concept—one is a job interview, one is surviving on an island. But then this year we’ve also produced a season of Design Star for HGTV. We are about to produce Your OWN Show, for OWN, the Oprah Winfrey Network, which is an honor. We’re really happy to be doing that.
I do like competition. If you see Bully Beatdown, a show of ours that airs on MTV, it takes bullies, [who] have really given their victims a hard time, and we challenge them: “If you are so tough, get in an MMA [Mixed Martial Arts] ring with a professional fighter and see how tough you are and we’ll pay you $10,000.” All of these bullies accept the challenge and mostly they lose. It’s an anti-bullying show. I try to do things that have some sort of good values to them. But we do other shows, too. We do How’d You Get So Rich with Joan Rivers and it’s very funny. We do The People’s Choice Awards, which we are also distributing overseas. We do the MTV Movie Awards. It’s not all competition, although I suppose at some level People’s Choice and Movie Awards are competitive because awards are being given out.

WS: Tell us about Sarah Palin’s Alaska and what you found appealing about the project?
BURNETT: Sarah Palin is obviously highly recognizable and highly watchable. This is a project I really want to do. I really love Alaska. I thought there was no one who could speak to Alaska and the Alaskan way of life in a more compelling way than Governor Sarah Palin. So I was very excited when she agreed to do Sarah Palin’s Alaska. It’s a mix of Alaska the state, the hard-working lives of Alaskans and her own family and how they as Alaskans live their lives. In a way it’s a love letter to Alaska told through the eyes of Sarah Palin. She is extremely hard working and loves and knows her state.

WS: Survivor has shown unprecedented longevity. What are the most important reasons it has done so well for so long?
BURNETT: There is only one reason. In terms of the network shows, whether it’s Survivor, The Apprentice or Shark Tank, which is coming back on ABC for a second season, it all comes down to one thing, and that is storytelling. Everything comes down to characters and story-telling. That’s why there are a few shows in non-fiction television that have been around for a very long time, not all of them are mine, but they revolve around great storytelling.

WS: What do you look for when you are casting, because I imagine that is a pretty critical element for your shows.
BURNETT: Yes, whether you are making a Broadway show or you are doing television or movies, casting is everything. It’s all about people; it’s all about story, so we take casting very, very seriously. We’ve found some great characters over the years. We got Jeff Foxworthy on Are You Smarter than a 5th Grader?, he’s great, so are the contestants [who] are playing that show. We consider everybody on the show and try to make them worthy of a good story.

WS: Are there shows you haven’t done yet that you would really like to do?
BURNETT: Yes, there are. I’m very interested in epic storytelling and I would like to try a mini-series.

WS: On television, people’s behavior can change just because the camera is rolling. How do you get natural behavior from contestants on your shows even with the cameras rolling?
BURNETT: The main reason that there are natural behaviors on camera is because the contestants are mainly in a competitive environment and they are more worried about beating each other and dealing with so much in such a short time. On Survivor, within about an hour they have forgotten about the cameras because a) they have to build shelter and find food, b) they are learning how to deal with each other and c) they are trying not to get voted off the show. On The Apprentice, they’ve got Donald Trump to deal with and they’re going around New York City trying to win the tasks they are given. They are so busy, they don’t have time for grandstanding, they just have time to try to win and that overrides hamming for the cameras. Clearly, there are shows in nonfiction TV where there does seem to be a lot of hamming. But some of those shows, where people are very aware of the cameras, seem to be getting good ratings.

WS: How do you strike a balance between observational documentary style and building the narrative of a show in the editing room?
BURNETT: All the good shows, whether it’s The Bachelor, Hell’s Kitchen, The Biggest Loser, Survivor or The Apprentice, as well as Your OWN Show, the Oprah Winfrey Network show I’m doing, start the editing process knowing the outcome—it’s already been shot. So they edit the show backwards, because clearly someone who is going to get eliminated in the show needs to have some sort of story in the first act. Everybody has a story, we can cut the show 20 different ways depending on who we focus on, but clearly we need to chose a few characters per episode, because you can’t be telling the stories of 20 people in one episode. You need to focus down on manageable storylines the audience can follow along and enjoy.

WS: Compared to the days when Survivor, Big Brother and Who Wants to Be a Millionaire?, which were really the granddaddies of what came to be called reality tele­vision, first aired, is it easier today to convince a broadcaster to try something new, to take a risk on a new idea?
BURNETT: I really don’t know the answer to that question. I just try to talk to cable channels and broadcasters about shows that I think would be compelling because I’m obviously committed to them. I don’t know if they are any riskier or less risky than other projects. In the end, who knows where the next great idea is coming from and everybody wants to hear good ideas—it’s the collective consciousness of saying, “OK, we all agree this sounds great.” Some programs are derivative. Weekly competition elimination shows are derivative. But then great new shows come along. Undercover Boss is a great new show. Shark Tank was a great new show and then there are a lot of shows that have been on the air a long time. We have two cycles of The Apprentice per year and two cycles of Survivor per year. The Bachelor is doing fantastically. A lot of shows have been on for a long time and are doing very, very well.

WS: Are there any lessons that you learned when you first started out in television that you still use today to help you navigate the world of network television or while pitching shows?
BURNETT: The one thing to remember for me and I think for anybody is if you need to be 100 percent sure and have everything lined up perfectly, the show won’t happen. Everything I’ve done I’ve not been completely certain of. Maybe 50 percent or 60 percent of [the elements of a show] were lined up and I just jumped in and figured it out as I went along. If you need it all figured out and you want to be certain it’s going to be OK, you’ll never start anything.